jolin012

those seconds mustn't be interest free imo. I don't mind that some tend to take the risk and wait for the more time to pass. yes they might begin with 200 gold more than the ones who don't know what interest is, but was it a problem in the normal one that some begin with 70 and some with 71 gold?

yap. that's what i mean. so when maledict is composite i don't really mind that voodoo has a bit too strong support and a bit too low damage, and it involves luck/good placement required. to get as much of the damage dealt in the first 2,5 sec, and the attackers not to follow units and do the kills before maledict strikes again. ok, that might have been random ruybish bnut what i mean is, when maledict is changed back to composite and armor ignoring im fine for now the current setup

oh, so why did you cahgne the numbers?maybe i missed something but with the numbers i sugguested both buffs would increase dps by the exactly same amount.

I didn't yet have time to find where in your thinking process you did wrong, but at least I got some proof for now did a test several times with 4 magics buffed by either lvl 2 well or smith. and when buffed by well the damage count it got always landed around 8-10k higher (around 5-10%). Smith proved too weak every time and here I have saved and uploaded one with well and one with smith. (This is easily tested with the commands for gold lumber and lvl. the replays are around 2 minutes each): beta 11 127253 smith magic.w3g beta 11 135524 magic well.w3g

Maledict belongs to it's buff and should therefore and like I explained be composite and armor ignoring. It's damage should, if we want the map balanced, be equal to all the other support triples. Which currently isn't the case (corrosion beeing the strongest triple with around 12000 dps, and voodoo polar and enchantment relying on 300 dps). Aswell as it's buff should be equal. When i say equal it doesn't have to be straight equal say all having 3000 ST damage at 900 range. It's ok with an avarage dps beeing equal, with factors like luck, skill, micro and more coming into play, perhaps even like with enchantment/corrosion that the lower damage one has it's effect last longer.

Yes, I meant to decrease build time, ie build faster. but now that you mention it kaini, maybe the game loses a bit more of the strategy that way. Although in random i find it more fun to switch between lvls (which was more possible in 3.0 when wave-countdown timer was 5 sec and not 3) and rather boring to build all supporters and a couple of damagers and basicly sit there and wait. and random will never be balanced anyway:P so - I'm not sure what's best for the map, but I'd like to see a little bit faster building.

often when you chose random mode and summon lumber it tends to crash at level 20. but that is due to testing conditions only.

I like the command idea. but a mode for it seems unnessesary.

oh right, Cisz's one works a little bit different. and btw, not to compleain, but why not start at something that looks ike 60/60/60 in the table? instead of 60/65/70 when we know it'll change a bit anyway. And, we found a way to concentrate the 6ele power just like 4ele instead of having that one spread, but that might not be nessesary as the 4ele supporters cost less.

oh sorry, I didn't notice you made them last up to 120 seconds

yap, and, with jinx, the jinx tower kept attacking a creep even though it got cursed. while hydro towers swithc target as soon as someone is tossed into the air.

For the one who wants to watch the lagfest I uploaded the replay now Ice tower lag.w3g

my fps was at 60. 55-60 when attacking with anything, like arrows, but also flame. Flame had no bad effect on my pc, not with one, not with 3. but one ice brought down that 55-60 to 45-50 and 3 ices took it to 40-45. it was 30 on undead. I will see what happens if I spamm the entire map with ice now 5min later, Results: I entered lv 60 with the entire maze spammed with Ice. Normaly my pc would lag down to 1fps, and if it'd be say water tower (superfast) perhaps 0,5 fps. but now I'm having one frame every minute what a lagfest.

Trickery tower was decided to be changed to summon clones, several clones needed at higher levels, with either lower damage or a longer "don't copy me"-marker But when I tested it I sadly found that lvl 1 2 and 3 all use the same effect with the same time. Level 3 trickery sn't even close to giving 200% boost, by copying a tower for one clone a 4th of the time. that means 25%. it should be 2 clones for each target, full time. Unless you decide to use what I suguested (lowering it's damage instead of having a marker, but don'ttouchmemarker is good with me as long as the right times are implented.) a long time ago.

In build rebalance I added the numbers that have been attempted to be implented (ie, I don't care if one tower failed and became imbalanced, i used the numbers that i guessed this version was aiming for) and got following results of build strength: 3332 90,0 3332 101,4 33311 96,6 33311 41,9 33221 73,5 33221 135,0 32222 71,6 332111 86,8 332111 67,4 322211 59,1 322211 60,6 222221 109,7 Which means that the best use of any 5 ele build will result in 135 dmg/sec/gold and the best use of any 6 ele build will result in 109,7 dmg/sec/gold and the best use of a 4ele build with 2 support duals will result in 90 dmg/sec/gold and the best use of any 4ele build including a suport dual and 2 support triples will result in 101,4dmg/sec/gold. That is a big build imbalance, with a 50% better use of 5ele than 4ele double dual. How about attempting to implent numbers that will actually succeed instead? And by the way, The game suddenly got alot easier. I beat the game with only electricity and blacksmith at area 7 in first try on pick, without any interest farming. So I'd sugguest trying to stay below a total of 100dpspg unless we want to change all hp or armor or stuff again.

Magic and Mushroom now have a new concept but when I sugguested the numbers I am sure I made Very Clear that If the pool is 45 and the regen is 5 then level 1 well should grant 9 mana change when casting, lvl 2 should grant 15 mana on casting and lvl 3 should grant 30 mana when casting. And still, I find that it grants 4/8/30 instead which makes me sad. There is just no reason, those numbers are wrong, mine were even perfectly exact.

I can see in the change log that it sais triple support change "-Support Triples from 25/50% to 10/30%" and that's not really true. Ofcourse you can not right every tower but I must say that all support triples are not equal. for example we've allready discussed that 30% slow is not a 30% boost. and 9 armor is not a 30% boost either. witchcraft is even further away from that I think. Also Not only the % matters. For example hydrocloric has more than double damage of an enchantment tower, and both of the towers need 2-3 towers to keep creeps struck for 15 sec. This might be planned to be fixed at later stages though, just reminding that it didn't get solved by these changes of b11.

We have been promised decreased upgrade/build speed since a long time ago, and I'd like to see taht in the next change log.

First of all I'd like to say b11 has many good improvements, but several failed improvements aswell. Before this beta I claimed that maledict had to be both armor and armor-type ignoring and in irc chat both K and Cisz agreed. But I read in the change log that you turned into Darkness Damage. That is wrong as the damage it repeats already is treated by armor-type.

ya, when it always ends up with the health that the creeps have i don't see the reason for it. but it's not annoying so i don't mind, just that i don't know how to find it useful. Healing waves should give a higher damage count the slower you kill them.

Hm i think you are misunderstandig. I mean: Every fly makes AoE damage. (128 = length of a tower). But maybe I am misunderstanding you. no, i understood it just right and i meant randomly dropping bombs around it is rather random i was guessing

hm, would most likely make the tower even more random but perhaps it can be tried out if the current replacement of the tower fails.

welcome to the board fang

Thanks alot Kaini

For the one who unlikes long post, a tip; the picture explains everything. Ok, done now, took a bit of time as i had to try all the tiers. Here are the results. Sinlge Towers (X beeing sound O beeing silent): [pre:2q7rh1mz]. Element L D W F E N Tier 1 X X X X X O 2 X X X X X O 3 X X X X X X 4 X X X X O X 5 X O O O O X[/pre:2q7rh1mz] All Dual towers had a sound. Triple towers(X beeing sound O beeing silent): The only triples beeing Silent were Gold 1, Gold 2, Laser 1, Laser 2 and FlameThrower 2. Periodic Tower of the Elements is Silent. Here comes a pic but meh, it was really troublesome had to convert first to bmp but it didn't accept that either so converted again, but here it is at last: Silent Towers.png