jolin012

To speak honestly and clearly... yes, pretty much for sure.

That makes it alot better, but still not good enough for me, cause I'm abit picky with this tower . sorry that I have to disagree again.. This tower would be alot more playable in random than smith and well, cause it can rebuild between waves and rebuild the damage towers, unlike fired up towers, cause they lose the 60sec buff. This trickery would also lose the 60sec cooldown when rebuilding, but if that is prevented by a starting cooldown the earlier mentioned problem would be worse I fear. I guess this tower still needs manual targeting... one by one... that's another major problem :/ A rather minor problem would be the location of this tower, that the buff has the location of the trickery and not of the damagetower. so - either in the situation where I have like 3 towers i want my trickery to buff and they all need different placement, say one tidal (center 5) one flame (corner 4) and one zealout (lower 4 right of flame) I want them all to get their buff where =they= need it. another problem would be that kindle tidal and all those towers need to be on a placement that is limited. and if I use this trickery as my boost, there's nowhere to place my trickeries as the only good spaces are taken by the real towers. One more problem is towers like flesh golem that charge up. Their boost helps them charge up faster. All boosts, except this one. I guess this trickery solution of mine wouldn't fail at any point so - I dunno what's wrong with it if it isn't cause it seems too hard to code, but I doubt that, seems easier to code imo, although I know nothing about that to be honest.

ah, close ya, can get rather mad when failing no leaks after as many attempts as getting a lucky random requires

yep, the tech center or research center is wher ya spend your lumber. build a laser tower behind that and it'd rarely reach anything

oh yes, you're absolutly right. I guess quantum was an older beta's name for the tower.

Quantum is a tower:) It requires alot of micro to work at all, and around max 4 can be used successfully that way

Yep that's exactly what I mean hole, (To take longrange issue for example: )and a "net result similar" is not enough I think. As if longrange towers cannot be used effectively in a build that has this trickery as it's dual.

gunpowder upgrading is weird . It does not only increase it's damage to 5 times the damage like all other duals. It increases the damage AND the AoE Size, the Splash, of it's attack. Which I have never really understood

Even though you can solve the problems on some specific towers, it's allready a basic mistake to make a dual that targets curses Creeps instead of buffs towers. As I mentioned a Dual should favor longrange as much as shortrange, ie, it can not target creeps cause that makes it only work in a small area, a 2pass or longpass, something for a shortrange tower. The number of duals built should be dependant on how many towers you have, and favor fewer strong towers. While this one targets creeps it is dependant on creepwave's length instead.. while the spells of smith&well lasts 60 seconds it has never really been possible to use them in random mode if you're selling rebuilding damagetowers every wave. another one of the differances between cursers(triples) and buffers(duals) that makes trickery wouldbe the only dual to work with selling/rebuilding between waves.

sorry for all the hate, here's a more neutral question.. Does it stack?

let me help you rephrace that. You meant "yes. the best tower in 4.0 public beta is periodic." Maybe we shall stop spreading that it's overpowered, so that we don't make everyone like it and use it before we remove it's power. they will hate us

oh, the second idea wouldn't that make splash around 15 times as strong?:s and once they're all put together in one small ring manual targeting could be used to select the creep in the back to move all backwards. And I think immolation is not something we need.

First of all, I don't like that this 3rd superdual targets creeps and not towers. That Does matter, cause for duals, that're meant to target tower, favorslongrange a little bit, while those who cast on the creeps on ground fails really to cooperate with longrange. (nova for example, you need 6 of it to slow the entire area that a longrange tower attacks on. 2novas are enough to slow a regular 2pass placement. Also this tower doen't make killing bosses any easier. aka, if you have this instead of well or smith you'll fail on bosses.. Super Easy? Might sound like it at first, but I doubt it's easy to make it work with all the complicated spells and such. Let me list the first I come to think of. Electricity, Does every bounce deal out aditional damage to a nearby creep? Drowning, Will it spread the instantkill or chance or? Kindle, Will it spread damage every seconds? Spells/Effects overall? Like Windstorm, will the damage be forwarded? It's not meant to with storm imo(that a dual can buff it), but for example Ice that is currently a damagetower (also needs to go imo but that's another story and perhaps another version of the map heh) Ideas are good, but to be really honest, cause, to speak clearly (might sound abit harsh) I don't want another (rather wasted) trickery betatested when I feel like I know it won't work...

Sorry hole, the reason why it wasn't used wasn't just cause it was too weak, but because it only worked in like one situation of the game, and at one area (therefore I have had use of it in random once or twice, not only talking of killing elementals), so it does need a replacement

^^ I'd have earth 2 earth 3 and a pure essence aka periodic rather than earthshaker yes and why don't you come on the irc for talking 'bout nothing instead? btwm you could meet karawasa, as he is back on track

no, I wouldn't, but I wouldperhaps rather have 3 quakers and 3 lumber than 1 earthshaker and no lumber x) and yes, this is not not a serious discussion, for help, refer to the first 3 post-replies

A dual shot would mean one "bonus" shot would follow shortly after every 4th regular shot (every 5th shot if counting with the bonusshots themselves). The time after would be perhaps 0,1 seconds after, but to be tested to see what looks the best (I'd like both arrows/shots to be seen for example. So, there is a 0,1 cooldown only after every 4th attack. After the 5th attack there is an X-0,1 cooldown, X beeing the tower's regular cooldown. that'd mean after the bonus arrow the cooldown is only 0,9 sec for an arrow tower, meaning there is Always 1 second between every "normal" arrow. At the 3 different tiers of the tower it would look somehintg like this: (ignore this table if it makes no sence) [pre:1yy63mbp]. Tier 1 Shot number: | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10| CoolDown after attack | 1 | 1 | 1 |0,1|0,9| 1 | 1 | 1 |0,1|0,9| Total Time after attack and CD| 1 | 2 | 3 |3,1| 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 |7,1| 8 | . 10 shots fired in 8 seconds . Tier 2 . Shot number: | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | CoolDown after attack | 1 |0,1|0,9| 1 |0,1|0,9| 1 |0,1|0,9| Total Time after attack and CD| 1 |1,1| 2 | 3 |3,1| 4 | 5 |5,1| 6 | . 9 shots fired in 6 seconds . Tier 3 . Shot number: | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | CoolDown after attack |0,1|0,9|0,1|0,9|0,1|0,9|0,1|0,9| Total Time after attack and CD|0,1| 1 |1,1| 2 |2,1| 3 |3,1| 4 | . 8 shots fired in 4 seconds[/pre:1yy63mbp] Ignore this part too if it makes no sence, they're all basicly telling the same thing: So, the spell would be like: (at tier 2) after every 3rd attack (beginning with attack 1) decrease attackspeed to X sec/attack. after every 3rd attack (beginning with attack 2) increase attackspeed to 0,1sec/attack. after every 3rd attack (beginning with attack 3) decrease attackspeed to X-0,1 sec/attack (X beeing the attackspeed it'd be without this spell).

that costs you elemental picks

kirby isn't lying, but let me clear things out to make it more helpfull. You should pick all of the elements if you want the best build and first of all build one of each of these towers: Windstorm, Nova, Roots, Muck, Corrosion, Enchantment, Polar, Voodoo. those are support towers. You hould also have at least 2 wells and 2 blacksmiths out there. Then you need damage towers. After level 51 you will get your first pure essence that allows you to build the periodic tower of elements. that is the strongest tower in the game. before that is available if you want to build something else, go for 1 zealout and 3 quakers good luck! Edit: Oh, and if you don't know how to build these towers (for example if you don't know windstorm is F+L+W) you can always press F9 ingame or look it up here: http://www.eletd.com/triple-towers.php http://www.eletd.com/dual-towers.php

I know, when I say i did 3 pick games the 2 later where on ap cm, but failed, got too greedy and leaked to death with like 80% of the gold unspent ^^ so - could definitly be done, just a matter of how many more tries it'd take, yawn .

Oh noes, are you going to fight back? I had 3 pick games allready and that's by far enough

do you mean doubles damage every 4th shot for 60 seconds? that sounds even more alike blacksmith, especially at tier 3. A 25/50/100% chance for crit hit (double damage) would be better, but I think seeing 2 attows fly makes the first idea most unique and good. Edit: this would not work with for example electricity(if effect following it's attackspeed) and tidal.

or "rather so random"

Hm, first try so it's not really great, but somewhere above 400 ronalds if I remember correctly. The build is $FEWD EWDF EF Overall rather sucky wtith many leaks, hunt begins at less than 10 lives as far as i remember. Edit: let me add VH AP 400+ Ronalds to clear things out 500 ron dfew.w3g

no, as mentioned (and I know it's too much to read) they do not, and are not meant to be able to buff. if you cast for example Fire up (the buff the blacksmith deals out) on a mushroom tower, and then upgrades the mushroom tower into a roots tower, the roots tower has the spell, else it's not possible to target or for it to autocast on such towers. If you obtain the effect through upgrades, it will do nothing to your tower, basicly making it deal 2-2 instead of 1-1 which is just an attack to cause the spell to attack on the place and time you select the root tower to attack. Short answer: No, they can not get the speed/attack buff at all, and if they would be targetable, they would no gain advantage out of it. Edit: I just noticed I never mentioned it in this thread so I take back my first sentance.