jolin012

Imo they should not reset when leaked. Mechanical creep have a certain % of their time as invulnerable, which could be considered to reflect a certain % much harder. (but ofc there are otehr factors like ST/Splash and how your defense looks). Anyhow, also should undead have a certain % harder, which can be considered out of the total % hp added. Which is around 25% if I'm not sure. I don't think 25% more should be added when leaked. it already is that. That explanation though, probably makes no sence, so let me put it this way instead, If i build say kindles at 5, but the creep succeed to not die even once, but with a very low health. I better not kill some of them at area 9, cause that would reset their hp to 33% (or 25 or whatever it is) and as the pass through the exit, also reset the ankh.

They were not yet leaked for sure. It was during wave 56. I am almost sure the towers i was using was ice electricity well nova and windstorm.

but it gets a new one when leaked^^

I have also seen undeads walking backwards, in this version. I could erserach which towers i used if needed.

Thank you for helping us out. I believe that this was exactly what i tried to show through my replays at the top but I wasn't clear enough. Now I'm filling the application to see if I understood K right and if he understood what i meant Everything rounded to no decimals [pre:s95ylt7t]All towers level 1, damage/second/tower values for b11: +----------+--------+---------+ dmg/s/tow| no boost | w/well | w/smith | ---------+----------+--------+---------+ mushroom | 1667 | 1982 | 2083 | ---------+----------+--------+---------+ magic | 1667 | 2083 | 1982 | ---------+----------+--------+---------+ Boost towers level 2, damage towers level 1, damage/second/tower values for b11: +----------+--------+---------+ dmg/s/tow| no boost | w/well | w/smith | ---------+----------+--------+---------+ mushroom | 1667 | 2311 | 2500 | ---------+----------+--------+---------+ magic | 1667 | 2500 | 2311 | ---------+----------+--------+---------+ Boost towers level 3, damage towers level 1, damage/second/tower values for b11: +----------+--------+---------+ dmg/s/tow| no boost | w/well | w/smith | ---------+----------+--------+---------+ mushroom | 1667 | 5000 | 5000 | ---------+----------+--------+---------+ magic | 1667 | 5000 | 5000 | ---------+----------+--------+---------+[/pre:s95ylt7t]

No it doesn't cause at the end of my calculation I divide it by the total number of seconds one round of work and rest takes, to find the dmg/sec. . 15 mana would reduce the rest time by 3, meaning 3 sec work 3 sec rest 3 sec work 3 sec rest etc etc. and there is no reason to find it's avarage damage by taking the first 9 seconds, beeing 3 work 3 rest 3 work, and say that 6/3 is it's avarage. it's avarage is 3/3 when the rest time is 3 sec and the last time is 3 sec. and then i divide it by 6 to find the dmg/sec. what? afaik I Do see the full result here: 3 sec 3 sec _____________ + ________ | 1500+2000 | + | 1500 | = (10500+4500)/6 = 2500 No way. Cause by reducing the mana we are reducing the rest period and that reduces the total time of the period it takes to do one work and one rest. How i explain it is cause 15 mana reduce means 3 sec less rest. Not 3 sec less rest and 3 sec more last. Why should there me more last time? There is nothing to increase the time that the ability lasts. How I explain the difference between those numbers is that by not taking for granted that 3 sec less cooldown takes 3/6 to 6/3 but what it does is to make it 3/3 and later I will divide it by 6 instead of 9 as you can see in the calc. And how you get 2833 is by saying that it will last for 6 sec and then rest 3 if i add 15 mana. I really don't see any problem

We all know kindle should be buffable? So - how come it yet isn't? If the problem is that you don't know how to, let me revive one of my ideas for that. Take the quaker ability (20% chance for stomp - 300 damage in 750 AoE). Change it to Fire damage and change all sounds models etc etc. Change it to a 100% chance for 200 damage instead, which means every attack it will deal 200 damage in a 750 aoe, and if blacksmith buffs it it'll do more than 200 and if well buffs it it'll do so more often. Give kindle an 1-1 attack that fires at attackspeed 1. Tada, simple as that.

The problem with your calculations is that you keep the ability time constant and instead change the divisor to reflect the difference in time. well, that is exactly how it should be, because the time that the ability lasts doesn't change. only the time it is inactive before turned on again and be changed through the mana gain. Correct, when we add 15 mana that makes up for 3sec last 3sec rest, and as you can see in my calculation, that together with a failed 50% boost makes up for a total of 2500dps which is a 50% boost(from the regular of 1666,67). First of all, what do you mean by "Faithful". Why would 6 sec last and 3 sec rest be faithful when the regular is 3 sec last and 6 sec rest? What has an ability with 6 sec last and 3 sec rest to do with this? You can't change the lasttime. you can only change the rest time. so 6/3 would equal 3/1,5. but what do we want 3/1,5 aka 2833,33 for? isn't it better with the numbers I found that add 25%/50%/200% instead of 70%?

yes, I also heard it had 550+600+650+700=2500 damage. else it'd be 2300. flame and ice should both be above 2500 and kindle reaches 2400, but at it's location it can rush and gain huge advantage of slowing towers.

Just finished a vh ap xsm game no leak. FLFLFLEEENW is the build I used. Will try it without Nonshort if I feel like. did one minor mistake building several electricity 2 towers when i had electricity 3 available, so i had to sell at the loss of about 500 gold. Neither was the build the best. should've picked nature 2 instead of water. perhaps even left earth 2 out, which would also give me more money when i didn't need extra towers just to kill the elemental. beta 11 vh apxsm noleak..w3g

I was still curious about why my replay proves lv 2 is 10% wrong, and I wanted to redo my calcs with the correct numbers. but i would find that it was no prob to have the wrong numbers in terms of ability strength. when I replaced +3000 with +2000 I found that it doesn't make a difference. it doesn't matter how much the ability boosts by, it'll still be the same amount of mana. I tested the math for your numbers of mana too, and it showed that lvl 1 s about 5% final dps wrong and lv 2 is about 10% final dps wrong. But these do give the exact numbers. Nothing has been rounded up or down anywhere (except the final outputs 1666,67 and 2083,33) The regular would now be: 3 sec 6 sec _____________ + ________ | 1000+2000 | + | 1000 | = (9000+6000)/9 = 1666,67 Good lvl 1: 3 sec 6 sec _____________ + ________ | 1250+2500 | + | 1250 | = (11250+7500)/9 = 2083,33 Bad lvl 1. 9 mana added: 3 sec 4,2 sec _____________ + ________ | 1250+2000 | + | 1250 | = (9750+5250)/7,2 = 2083,33 Good lvl 2: 3 sec 6 sec _____________ + ________ | 1500+3000 | + | 1500 | = (13500+9000)/9 = 2500 Bad lvl 2. 15 mana added: 3 sec 3 sec _____________ + ________ | 1500+2000 | + | 1500 | = (10500+4500)/6 = 2500 Good lvl 3: 3 sec 6 sec _____________ + ________ | 3000+6000 | + | 3000 | = (27000+18000)/9 = 5000 Bad lvl 3. 30 mana added: 3 sec 0 sec _____________ + ________ | 3000+2000 | + | 3000 | = (15000+0)/3 = 5000

ya, I'd like to know wether how this stacks too. I guess the effect of a creep beeing burning isn't stackable, but that if several creeps close to one are burning it suffers more damage/sec.

replay or it didn't happen. kindle is great vs nature and not too bad vs healing. electricity at 3 for example gives the creeps 30 sec to regen. kindle puts out all damage withiin only 12 sec. also kindle has 2400dps(200dmg*12sec) while electricity has 2500dps(550+600+650+700).

This bug was in pb as well i just forgot to report it. Undead units that already used their revive or ankh of reincarnation get a new one when they are leaked.

Not cause it's you that think so but i must add my oppinion here and disagree. kindle is almost as good as electricity. and so is probably gunpowder too. flame aswell. quark mush and magic are meant to be a bit weaker as they are the only who can touch bosses. and killing bosses is important for duals. Although those 3 might be a bit too weak. (beeing at 1666dps while electricity for exampl is at 2500.) However, I will wait a bit before I am sure of what I find to be imbalanced and so. I yet have too little experience with b11 i think. about the map, it is currently perhaps a bit too hard. and I might agree with 13est that composite should be reduced to 85% now that we also buffed fast and healing.

Nice!

hey, what about composite? well that's not an element though;). how about 2x2x2 with 6 sides. Every side has a big icon in the middle that cuts of a bit of every of the 4 squares of each side. but also one each of the 4 squares on each side there are 4 monsters, the fast healing undead and mechanical of that element

I did a vhsrsmcm with holepercent and kaini. Ice proved to be able to kill someone with it's lag even in a normal game. (and not only cause i did -gold 999999 and spammed the entire map). Lag made me unable to switch the ice for quark when darkness came. Edit: added the replay. beta 11 vhsrsmcm icelag.w3g

Oh, yes. I am an idiot

I know he meant the attack by that, but we were speaking of both the damage and the ability.

I listed them all on request for public beta^^

Eurg. Ask your tidal if he will like that

light and darkness are equal in damage/second. Darkness has double damage but light has double speed, like Cisz sais. and the misses of light makes up for the overkill of darkness. although light can be easier avoided by micro perhaps, but that doesn't really matter enough to actually make a noticable differance. What Does make a differance is that high damage things with low damage get their damage concentrate so badly that they have hard to spread it. but I guess that will change now that prices are lower-> more towers.

that sounds like alot of fun. but i guess that's not what we call balance around here. we allready have undead healing mech and undead which make different towers and placement favor different levels.

ok here it goes. this was how I was thinking: I count as if the tower regularly had 1000 damage (and 1 attack/sec) and the regular avarage output would be 2000 damage. I decided to divide it into 2 periods, one with the ability on and one with it off. the one on I have divided the damage into 2 parts, one that is the regular damage(always buffable) and one that is the bonus damage(or speed in mushroooms case). I call it 1000+3000 for a regular mush. and the damage that is not with the ability on is just 1000. Then I take the total damages for each side and multiply it with the number of secods they are active. in the regular case (1000+3000)*3 and (1000)*6. I add them together. 12000+6000=18000. After that I divide it by the total time (3+9) to get the avarage damage/second. 18000/9=2000. This is for the regular non buffed mush or magic. 3 sec 6 sec _____________ + ________ | 1000+3000 | + | 1000 | = (12000+6000)/9 = 2000 And so I moved on and tested with the good and bad buff on the towers. Good buff always gave the % buff they should, but for the "bad" buff I had to change the time that the non buffed section lasts= aka the ability CD. Here is for the "Good" lvl 1 buff: 3 sec 6 sec _____________ + ________ | 1250+3750 | + | 1250 | = (15000+7500)/9 = 2500 for lvl 2 buff I had to reduce the time that the non buffed section is active into 4,2 seconds. that means 9 out of 45 mana less needed. Here is for the "Bad" lvl 1 buff: 3 sec 4,2 sec _____________ + ________ | 1250+3000 | + | 1250 | = (12750+5250)/7,2 = 2500 as you can see, with a cooldown for "lvl 1 bad buffed" of 7,2 sec (and a lost time of 3 sec so only a 4,2 sec wait) the final dps is as it should. that means 1,8 sec less than regular. and 1,8 sec is 9 mana, therefore the tower bad buffed tower should be granted 9 extra mana when casting it's ability to reduce the time it doen't use ability into 4,2 sec. Here is for "good" lvl 2 buff: 3 sec 6 sec _____________ + ________ | 1500+4500 | + | 1500 | = (18000+9000)/9 = 3000 And i found that the non ability period should last for 3 sec on lvl 2 bad buffed ones here at the "bad" lvl 2 buff: 3 sec 3 sec _____________ + ________ | 1500+3000 | + | 1500 | = (13500+4500)/6 = 3000 With a 3 sec shorter nonactive time that means 15 mana should have to be added for a "lvl2 bad buff"ed tower every time it's ability is cast. and here goes for "good" lvl 3 buff: 3 sec 6 sec _____________ + ________ | 3000+9000 | + | 3000 | = (36000+18000)/9 = 6000 And here is what i calced for the "bad" lvl 3 buff: 3 sec 0 sec _____________ + ________ | 3000+3000 | + | 3000 | = (18000+0)/3 = 6000 With a 6 sec shorter nonactive time that means 30 mana should have to be added for a "lvl3 bad buff"ed tower every time it's ability is cast. Simple as that.