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Kaini

New Terrain

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Keep it short and simple: It sucks!

There are some points that are really bad:

[*] Never, never try to mix themes in a map (in a arena). That is going to look really ugly chaotic and strange![/*:m:xvh3562s]

[*] The build area must have clear borders! It is really hard to know where to build now. Maybe it will look a bit more boring - but thats ok.[/*:m:xvh3562s]

But I never criticize without suggestions:

Try to make per element a own arena. The two areas left can be something different (per example Ice and Composite)

- or -

Make a competition. Every player may submit a Area and the best 8 will be in the game. The winners get as reward a nice creep in the top right of their terrain. :)

But the area has to follow some rules:

[*] clear borders for the tower area[/*:m:xvh3562s]

[*] exactly one theme per arena[/*:m:xvh3562s]

[*] not too much doodads but not too less[/*:m:xvh3562s]

[*] ...[/*:m:xvh3562s]

I am really sorry that i have to complain that much :?

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First impression<.

Hard to se where to build, the elements have taken over the build place.

But at the same time, they look so "sad" all the elements.

They are just there and take upp space. Add some more eyetreats but without interfering to much with the build place.

But I think it was a good way to combine 6 elements on all place.

But should be done in a different way

(NICE WITH PORTALS!!)

comments.w3g

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As said elsewhere, I agree completely that there needs to be more distinction regarding build areas and the like. It would be helpful if you guys took screenshots of problematic areas, taking care to cover all 8 areas. That, we can get fixed.

I disagree with Kaini though :P. I like the new terrain. I get much more immersed in the game now; it feels great.

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my first two thoughts

1: Neat looking!

2: Where do I build?

The first big problem I see is the smooth slope between the areas where you can build and the walking path. Its hard for the eye to seperate them since the slope is so smooth. On the regular map its easy to see where you can build because of grass areas with the sharp edges around it made out of stone. So you both have the color difference and the hard edge.

I value that you are trying to add some eyecandy, but there is a very thin line between too much eyecandy and a usefull UI.

Three suggestions:

1: Make the slopes razor sharp again. This is the main reason I think its hard to see where to build.

2: No trees between infront of a builing area. The ones infront of area 7 is a good example. Either keep the trees to a short size, or keep them to the north side of a building area. South of a building area tends to block the view.

3: Be carefull with adding too many doodads. Fixing 1+2 might mean that doodads aren't that big a problem.

Lastly, the new icons. They are beautifully made, i'm worried they aren't iconic enough but that might be that I just need to get used to them. Maybe all that is needed is to tone down the colors behind the symbols a little bit. To make a bigger contrast between the symbol (arrow/shield/ect) and the background.

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3: Be carefull with adding too many doodads. Fixing 1+2 might mean that doodads aren't that big a problem.
True! Per example the trees are nice but block a bit the sight.And please remove any moving doodads they are confusing.

Is there a way to change the camera?
Only in world editor afaik. Maybe there is a camera hack in the net.

As said elsewhere, I agree completely that there needs to be more distinction regarding build areas and the like. It would be helpful if you guys took screenshots of problematic areas, taking care to cover all 8 areas. That, we can get fixed.
Hard to se where to build, the elements have taken over the build place.
Full agree!

I disagree with Kaini though :P. I like the new terrain. I get much more immersed in the game now; it feels great.
Yes it looks cool, really :) But imho it would look cooler if we had a arena for every element.

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I miss the cliffs too, and the trees on the southern border are in fact a bit in the way.

But what bothers me most is that the sections are to small to do several terrains in them.

My suggestion is: Do one terrain typer per region, or maybe 2 with a very smooth transition. Void is great with lighting scenes, but I didn't notice any of that so far. Is the lighting not working in mp?

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My suggestion is: Do one terrain typer per region, or maybe 2 with a very smooth transition. Void is great with lighting scenes, but I didn't notice any of that so far. Is the lighting not working in mp?
You took the words right out of my mouth!

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Each region with one terrain type looks really great. Only two things bother me:

The map is too fragmented, and the cliffs are missing. Are there any other cliffs than the grassland ones? I can see that cliffs suck from a design pov, but this still has to function as a map. ;)

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1. Being not able to see building area clearly kinda sucks

2. Maybe add some kind of "fence" so we can see the build area more clearly

3. And.. Some specific terrain area for each element. This one looks kinda random (Still good IMO though)

EDIT:

This is kinda off-topic, but... How about the loading screen for 4.0?

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If It's not too much work one area per Element Would be better than this, yet This is still a great work, Well done Void! :D . However, I agree to everyone lse that it's good do clearly see where build areas are, and also some too large dooads that limit the sight.

But if we would do one region for each element what can we agree on about the 2 other? 2 with mixed eles, 3 eles each? one mechanical and one undead area?:P with shredders and death knights as dooads xD no, I'm not sure...

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Hey Void, sorry to be part of this wall of critisism. :?

Your mapping examples (the ones linked in your sig) clearly show that you are one excellent mapper, but none of those is similiar to this task. The eletd map is tiny compared to your older works, so you don't have room to let your usual skills shine. I'd say that you put to many different terrain styles into one playing area.

I'd really like to see some of your great lighting skills on eletd. Is it possible to use different lighting for different sections of the map? Or are those effects cinematic only?

About the cliffs: I guess they are needed for orientation purposes. I just checked the cliff options in worldedit. Can cliffs from different tilesets be combined? If so, then there is a good selection of them. Is there a reason why you didn't use them in your version? Do you think they look unnatural? Make the map look too much like a constructed maze?

Here are just some of them that I liked:

Cliff example 01.jpg

Cliff example 02.jpg

Cliff example 03.jpg

Cliff example 04.jpg

Cliff example 05.jpg

Cliff example 06.jpg

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quick post to clarify, i still think you did a good job Void. :)

I also like the idea with one theme for each area. If you redo it, maybe just do 1 area first?

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Good idea, then you might not have to do it all over the time.

Aslong as we/you have a "base" you can let your awesome terraining skills take over.

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I remember when kara gave us the last terrain, and everybody was "oh noes, make them all identical". I like how all of a sudden we all are "make 8 different ones". Much better imo. ;)

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Some comments.

The start and end locations aren't spot on. http://www.eletd.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=1375

The portals look great, but you don't have to use it for every single area. Caves would definitely go better with some themes.

Buildability issues:

Spaces that aren't actually buildable shouldn't show up as green.

This is area 1, but it's all over the place.

Area 1. Probably applies to all the areas.

This looks quite ugly:

It's for superweapons, right? If it is indeed intentional, at least wall it in and give it a proper space.

New icons:

I don't like them. For one, they're hard to recognize, and on top of that, the style is inconsistent with the rest of the icons.

And while I'm at it, I'd like to ask you again to declutter all the icons on the builder.

[pre:2oa3i9km]Move | Stop | Hold | (Superweapons camera toggle)

--------+---------+---------+----------

Patrol | | | Ad (Passive)

--------+---------+---------+----------

Build | Duals | Triples | Query[/pre:2oa3i9km]

untitled3.jpg

untitled2.jpg

untitled1.jpg

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And while I'm at it, I'd like to ask you again to declutter all the icons on the builder.

[pre:2h31pgp6]Move | Stop | Hold | (Superweapons camera toggle)

--------+---------+---------+----------

Patrol | | | Ad (Passive)

--------+---------+---------+----------

Build | Duals | Triples | Query[/pre:2h31pgp6]

What's ad?

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Guest Void

I'm officially remaking the terrain. I like the suggestion about different areas and I think I'm going to do that.

This time I want to hear what the community wants as well so I don't screw up.

For the elements I have here, do you think my choice of models/tiles is good? Or should I use different ones?

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Nono, I like the team with all six elements.

But they feel a bit "clumsy" some light areas look only like they are a big desert.

(hope you understand what I mean)

Try to have each element stronger effekts at the end of each playsers map, and less effektiv in the middle kinda melting together to a neutral element so you can se the map more easily. (composite maybe)

When writing the above, I came up with a new thing, you are problary a good painter and know about layers, composite should be the base layer and the others beside it.

If I am unclear please respond,

Please Discuss the ideas.

Current setup:

Hard to se where to play towers, sharper cliff borders.

Spread the elements more to the end, that way you can have more effects but it messes less and are not in the way from towers.

P.S. I LOVE the waterfall you did at one of the areas. And the portals it is cool.

Elements:

Earth, seems fine, a little more rocks.

Water, less beachy, more "coral" islands (more bubbles.)

Light, a desert doesn't look very light to me, (but reminds me of templar knights) maybe add some runes or something.

Darkness, just a scary forest, nothing "dark" about it.

Fire, seems nice, less earth, more fire

Nature, great with the trees, like light, maybe would be cool with a few wisps sneaking in the forest (like the orc mission) also i miss some (not much at all, just a little mushroom somewhere) of the fungus (deep forest)

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I vote for, 1 area for each element. it's too cluttery with 6 elements per area.. But I like alot of the parts involved... Here's my suggestion, if we want one maze per element and dunno what to do with the 2 others, those 2 could stay as they are now. Void could keep the ones he likes best, before he makes one area per element (If we decide upon doing this 1element/maze, and we seem to have a strong party for this change.).

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I also vote for one element per area, and cliffs seem to be needed too.

What was your reason to get rid of them? I assume you thought about it, right?

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Well... This is the current 6 terrain used and my suggestion (my suggestion is in italic)

-Blight (Darkness) -> It's just okay, but if each area will have each own elemental, you'll need a new terrain for darkness area because blight will be used for undead terrain

-Barren (Earth) -> Just correct

-Brick (Light) -> Actually, it need a change, but I really don't know any good substitute for light terrain, so I guess it's okay...

-Shallow water (Water) -> Just correct

-Red barren (Fire) -> How about using "red stone" or "lava crack" (from "dungeons" terrain)? I know it's unbuildable, but can the "unbuildable" status be changed somehow?

-Grassland (Nature) -> Just correct

About mechanical... Maybe use "black brick" or "tiled brick"?

And.... Please don't put too many trees on the playing field, it often blocks everyone's sight when they're about to build tower.

Some bushes is okay, but not trees

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