Cisz

The glowing final really stands out clearly.

It's great. Maybe the 4.0 could be a little clearer. Without the "/" in the 0 maybe?

Welcome. You might want to read the faq. You neither have nor need to get extra money through income, if you know what you are doing and don't play competitive multiplayer. As for placement, thats a very long story. And lfwd-n is the strongest build, but others are easier. Try to use goldmines and interest. Can you finish the map on very hard? If so, try a challenge. Do you have more questions? Fire away.

You posted in a thread about the strongest build.

@Chak - totally. Only one thing remains to be done to make this element shakeup a true success: I need to catch up some mayor sleep. Edit - added a legend and some formating to the results.

It's an aoe slow, and all of those are triples. We placed it here: So its dark, nature and earth, and the working title is "roots". Ofc this is nothing like what root is in 3.0.

Red would be at a serious advantage. Maybe he could choose the elements before the game starts, and all get the sequence displayed?

This is the result of a looong session with karawasa, mrchack and myself: ? Name Ability # ld U Moon Replicate * Creates replicas of towers* lw S Ice Ice Slow *Single target DoT and slow* lf M Lightning Chain Lightning *Gains dmg per bounce, jumps around* ln U Life Life *Gains 1 life every X attacks* le D Metal Teleport *Blink Tower* dw D Poison Poison Damage *Casts carrion swarm* df S Magic Possession *Creep walks backward* dn D Death Hand of Death *More damage if more HP* de A Iron Mortar *Long range AoE* wf A Steam Immolation *.....STACKS* # wn B Well Spring Forward *Well* we A Geyser Spout *X% chance, creep up, down and AoE dmg* fn S Sun Solar Slow *Undecided, needs to be a slow* # fe B Lava Inner Fire *Damage Boost* ne D Worm Berserk *Activate for increased damage/speed* ldw D Tidal Stackable Release *Charges up per attack, to unleash spell* ldf S Hexing Time Warp+Rupture *X% chance to hex, after X seconds unit will move back, and take damage based on distance traveled* ldn D Undead Summoning (skeletons) *Summons Skeletons* lde D Laser Reflection *Towers link into each other* # lwf S Storm Tornado Slow *Tornado* lwn A Hailstorm Meteorite *Select an AoE, meteors will fall randomly within that AoE* #lwe B Glacier Frostbite *Freezes creep, next damage received is doubled and creep is unfrozen* # lfn S Nova Radius Slow *Nova* lfe U Gold Greed *Gains gold based on damage dealt* # lne C Gemstone Faerie Fire *Armor Redux* # dwf C Acid Spew Acid *Acid* dwn A Drowning Instant Death *Instant Death* # dwe S Sludge Sludge Slow *Attacks slow in AoE, like old ice tower* # dfn D Necromancy Maledict *Curses unit, X second/s later, does damage based on HP lost* dfe A Flamethrower Incinerate *Lava Tower, on flamethrower* # dne S Roots Line Based Slow *Shockwave that slows and does DoT* wfn D Rainbow Impetus *Does damage based on distance projectile travels* wfe D Infernal Rage *Gains attack speed every attack, resets after not attacking* wne D Flesh Golem Flesh Growth *Gains damage based on damage dealt* fne A Dinosaur Pulverize *X% chance to do AoE damage* # The strong duals and triples. M: Multi-Damage S: Slow/Stun D: Damage A: AOE Damage B: Buffing C: Cripple And now I'll fall of my chair.

That is a ) a great idea, and b ) maybe comes from MagicalHacker.

They can get very close to each other. Like this. I disagree. Poison gives you -99%, aka minimum speed. I used it as my only slow in this replay and won w/o leak or pure. Sure, that can be easily adjusted in both directions as needed. That was Karawasas idea. I like it too. Now this is a concept I really like. Now I understand you problems with this towers a lot better. Although I think that rage is a basic force, so a wild creature fits very well with you design imo.

Ah - you got it both. Very good indeed.

Nice as allways?

I'm off to the b-net for a change, but I'll give you a first short answer about the duals. More to come. Water+Light = Hand of Life - Holy water. An altar of the forces of good that will subdue all but the most humble. (Not to confuse with life, this tower does more damage if the creeps health is higher.) Light+Earth = Berserk - A dwarven paladin, or maybe a golem or statue. Berserk could be read as blessing or power override. Dark+Nature = Rage - A wild beast, like a wildekin or a furbolg or maybe a satyr. Dark+Earth = Sun(Shockwave) - Sun was a line based composit dmg tower. It's elements were taken, but de firing in a line is not that hard to imagine. It could be a spear catapult, or some sort of gnome artillery. Or it could be evoking the forces of caves, projecting shadows, or sending shades or bats down the lane. Water+Earth = Mortar - A dwarven steam cannon. What else? Fire+Nature=Spout This tower needs to propell creeps through the air. It could be an ancient protector, or a treant, throwing boulders at the path.

Ronald is undergoing mayor changes. He will return as a winged fairy with a bazooka.

@13est: I want many people to understand this, so allow me to explain. Well, look at this list of all aoe slows (root and sludge get changed): lfn Nova lfw Storm dne Root dwe Sludge And this is how many of them are in which build: 1 ldwf 0 ldwn 1 ldwe 1 ldfn 0 ldfe 1 ldne 2 lwfn 1 lwfe 0 lwne 1 lfne 0 dwfn 1 dwfe 2 dwne 1 dfne 0 wfne 2 ldwfn 2 ldwfe 2 ldwne 2 ldfne 2 lwfne 2 dwfne See? They are spread out. And of cousre, every 0 gets something else as compensation. With all strong towers taken into account, every 4 element build has either 2 strong duals or 2 strong triples and 1 strong dual. For example: In my distribution wfne gets well and the inner fire tower, making all of it's towers fire faster and with more damage. But no aoe slow. While dwne gets root and sludge (both aoe slow now), and well. So inner fire must be worth about both aoe slows. For this to work, the three strong duals (well, replicate and inner fire) have to be about twice as strong as, say, acid, when on max level. So expect well do really do, er, well now. Er, not in my distribution, no. I keep fleshies as they are. Speaking of which, how come you didn't solve the golem challenge yet? Hm? Please ask more.

You are allowed to use disables, but you are not allowed to do nasty crap with them.

Absolutely. I'ts more of a very crude check to avoid any 0 or, say 17.

It is, and it's even very likely. If you make ronalds stand still (which is caused by towers like life, supernova, higly speeded sub zero), they will pile up, stuff the entrance, start spawning in the exit area and you you are toast sir. Many people see this as the best way to deal with ronald. The counter goes up high, so you might agree. I'd rather kill them all. All of them.

Yes, that's absolutely ok with me. @ocmassreo - jolin012 got it right. There are three common ways to play for extra money, and all of them don't work on multiplayer: Leak the same last creep of a wave sevel times while loosing only single lives. Pin one heling creep down with root or gem, sell everything else and wait 3 hours. Use a lot of slow to make a wave last like 3 minute to get extra interest. All this is not allowed in the challenges. You may ofc use root or gem, leak a lot and play with slows, use interest picks and stuff, but keep in mind not to overdo interest farming. If you total game time stays under 60mins and your total networth doesn't go to high (say, less than 130k at ronnie start), you will probably be ok. Even if you get higher on both numbers it might be still ok. It's a matter of judgement, so I will have to consider each replay. Hm - still noone has beaten this.

Here is my attempt: The strong towers are: fe New tower (with inner fire) ld Replicate (attack like rainbow in 3.0) wn Well dfn Maledict lwe Frostbite dwf Acid lne Enchantment (only fairy fire) dne Root (line based AoE slow/DoT) lfn Nova lwf Storm dwe Sludge (splash aoe slow like ice) Here are all towers: ldwfne # 1 ++ ld Moon 2 + + lw Hand of Life 3 + + lf Chain Lightning 4 + + ln Life (all but mech and undead) 5 + + le Berserk S 6 ++ dw Poison (all but mechs) S 7 + + df Possession 8 + + dn Rage 9 + + de Sun 10 ++ wf Steam #11 + + wn Well 12 + + we Mortar S 13 ++ fn Spout #14 + + fe Inner fire 15 ++ ne Teleport ldwfne 1 +++ ldw Impetus 2 ++ + ldf Meteorite 3 ++ + ldn Summoning 4 ++ + lde Greed S# 5 + ++ lwf Storm 6 + + + lwn Rupture S# 7 + + + lwe Frostbite S# 8 + ++ lfn Nova S 9 + + + lfe Time Warp #10 + ++ lne Enchantment #11 +++ dwf Acid 12 ++ + dwn Drowning (all but undead) S#13 ++ + dwe Sludge (slpash aoe slow) #14 + ++ dfn Maledict 15 + + + dfe Flamethrower (incinerate) S#16 + ++ dne Root (line based aoe slow) 17 +++ wfn Reflection 18 ++ + wfe Stackable Release 19 + ++ wne Flesh Golem (on probation) 20 +++ fne Dino S - This tower can slow or disable. # - This tower is one of the extra strong towers. Possession - Brainwashes a creep, forcing it to move towards spawn instead Frostbite - Freezes a unit for X seconds. If that unit is attacked while frozen, it receives double damage and is unfrozen Mortar - Long range AoE tower with minimum attack range Hand of Life - A tower that deals more damage if the current hp% of creep is stronger Berserk - Can cast Berserk, gaining attack speed and damage for X seconds Spout - When this tower attacks (with X% chance), the target will be launched into the air, dealing X damage to surrounding units when it lands Replicate - Creates a replica (may have X/X1/X2 replicas at one time) of targeted tower that lasts X seconds Time Warp - X second after this tower attacks a creep, that creep will be teleported back to where it was when it got attacked. X% chance of firing Meteorite - Tower hits a random spot within the tower AoE (some radius). Doesn't directly target mobs. High damage, medium AoE damage. High risk, high reward tower because you are not guaranteed a direct hit on creeps Impetus - Gives strength to attacks, causing them to deal greater damage the further away the target is Stackable Release - Tower has some ability that is pretty good. Every X attacks actually "charges up," the ability and so it gets better every X attacks until you choose to use it Reflection - Towers can link into each other, getting damage bonus and combining their attack into one Teleport - Blink but for structures Rupture - When casted on creep, will speed it up. Creep will take damage based on how fast it is moving Needs Name - A line based AoE slow/DoT Greed - A tower that gives gold to the player per attack, based on how much damage it does Rage - Tower gains attack speed for every attack, after X seconds of not attacking it loses this bonus Chain Lightning - Casts chain lightning that increases in damage every bounce (as opposed to decrease), after a few bounces it starts selecting random creeps to bounce to Maledict - Curses a unit, dealing damage to it every X seconds based on how much HP it has lost (since the curse started) All uncommented towers are as they used to be. The slows are distributed in a way so that every build has at least one. The towers that don't need slow (teleport, rupture, summoning) are placed in a way that they are mostly in builds with little slow. Likewise, towers that need slow, like dino, meteorite, and rage, are placed in builds with more slow. Here is the slow distribution for the 4 element builds (number of different slows, unweighted): 3 ldwf 1 ldwn 3 ldwe 3 ldfn 2 ldfe 1 ldne 3 lwfn 3 lwfe 1 lwne 3 lfne 3 dwfn 3 dwfe 3 dwne 3 dfne 1 wfne

Here is a quick view at what I have come up with so far: d New tower (with inner fire) d Replicate (rainbow like attack) d Well t Maledict t Frostbite t Acid t Enchantment (only fairy fire) t line based AoE slow/DoT (Root?) t Nova t Storm t Ice Reflection Stackable Release Impetus Drowning (all but undead) Time Warp Meteorite Teleport Chain Lightning Rupture Greed Rage Summoning Flamethrower (incinerate) Mortar Life (all but mech and undead) Poison (all but mechs) Steam Sun Hand of Life Berserk Spout Flesh Golem (on probation) Dino Possession (d is ofc strong dual; t strong triple) Edit @ Chak - your distribution is really good, I'm following in many parts.

Yes, and you won the challenge btw.

That's my impression too. Flesh golem can't solo as first triple.

That sounds really good actually.

If I get his right you are about to try some serious slowing action. That would be a great replay, but probably not a legit challenge win. Still, I want to see it.