The new resell option v0.84

[Megadramon]

For those who don't know, interest has been taken out of the game as of v0.84. The option that has replaced it is called resell, which is only available to all pick players. What this does is lessens the burden of tower reselling to 87.5% from 75% at level 1, and 100% at lvl2, meaning you're able to select this option twice during elemental picks.

This new change buffs random a little, removing the chance to get interest in late levels. It also makes AP much harder as you're unable to farm crazy amounts of interest by relying on powerful towers while spending only ~20% of your total minerals which I felt was way too easy. If AP players choose the option of 100% resell, they will be limited to 9 element picks, due to their 2 resell choices, from 11 elemental picks.

With this new change, I feel random is much more viable to play in terms of fruit level competition. Before 0.84, I never played random due to the fact that it was so much inferior to all pick in terms of fruit level. The only benefit from random was the challenge and that's it; although there was also 100% resell value, the work needed to be done to achieve a high networth compared to an AP player were worlds apart, and even then you wouldn't be able to catchup to their networth due to their interest advantage. AP could afk or minimize often while farming crazy interest while randomers constantly had to focus on each wave. I feel this new change significantly narrowed the skill gap between AP and random.

Though this change significantly screws me over since I was an AP whore constantly trying to find new ways to get a higher fruit score, I think this change was needed. I'd always laugh at the randomers working so hard in my games while I sipped my iced tea browsing forums, minimized on all pick. The difference between ap and random was truly unfair and unrewarding for the random player.

What do you guys think of this new change?

I also believe that this change makes the fruit level much harder, as it's not possible to achieve the amount of networth from pre-0.84 versions anymore, even with the best tower resell skills.

Also note that since interest has been removed, we don't start with extra interest either. Interest has been removed completely, with the exception of our starting interest rates.

[WindStrike]

I do like that idea that it fixes the problems regarding random mode. Gave it a shot and I was glad to not see interest pop up as a choice, which typically would've screwed me over in random.

However, the resell... doesn't seem worth it to me. I still haven't actually tried it out, but the fact that you lose two element picks for maxing resell seems excessive. Interest, we all knew it was busted. But resell... if you never did any selling to begin with because of knowing what the good tower placements are, what's the point? Unless you're doing a rush for periodic tower, it feels like pretty weak choice overall. On the other hand, it suddenly makes it possible for me to try that strategy out of trying to win using only non-combo towers.

[Megadramon]

I do like that idea that it fixes the problems regarding random mode. Gave it a shot and I was glad to not see interest pop up as a choice, which typically would've screwed me over in random.

However, the resell... doesn't seem worth it to me. I still haven't actually tried it out, but the fact that you lose two element picks for maxing resell seems excessive. Interest, we all knew it was busted. But resell... if you never did any selling to begin with because of knowing what the good tower placements are, what's the point? Unless you're doing a rush for periodic tower, it feels like pretty weak choice overall. On the other hand, it suddenly makes it possible for me to try that strategy out of trying to win using only non-combo towers.

If you never did any reselling to begin with, the new changes will force you if you want any hope of getting a good fruit score, otherwise if you don't resell, you'll most definitely get a lower fruit score compared to someone who constantly resells for interest.

The first time I played, I didn't go for any resells. The second time I played, I took advantage of 100% resell and got a much higher fruit score. I'd say that if you want a good fruit score, you're gonna want to get the two resells.

[Arc Project]

**This is my personal view of the resell feature. Suggestion was made here. This may or may not coincide with opinions of the developers.

Resell is intended as an option that offers a different play-style whereas interest upgrade was almost mandatory to be successful late game.

There are stages when a player must spend a lot of minerals to avoid leaks because his build is weak against certain elements or abilities(Speed, Image etc). As conventional AP never encouraged selling element towers, his towers become over-efficient. Instead of sitting in his bank as reserve minerals milking additional interests, those towers become over-efficient until the strength of creeps catches up. By offering 100% refund upon selling, tower efficiency can be maintained to be lean so there's less overkill yet no leaks.

Players who choose a more aggressive path can sell towers between wave intervals and rebuild them after interest tick over. This maneuver involves some risk because next wave may come pouring in unexpectedly.

Pure Element Towers with limited range(Fire, Nature, Water, Earth and Periodic) also come into play. They can be sold then rebuilt to catch up with creeps for constant damage.

Players can choose not to utilize resell upgrade just like skipping water element in favor of fire. Since this frees up 1-2 element slots, this opens up possibilities for a more lean hybrid build that can take care of multiple element/ability.

Example: A tier-two 3 element tower like Comet costs 5000 minerals. On Very Hard difficulty with 2% interest, selling 4 comet towers before an interest tick-over yields 400 minerals. 400 again if other players are taking longer to complete the wave. Those extra minerals will sit in reserve and keep rolling in additional interests for the remainder of the game.

If you never did any reselling to begin with, the new changes will force you if you want any hope of getting a good fruit score, otherwise if you don't resell, you'll most definitely get a lower fruit score compared to someone who constantly resells for interest.

Hmm. How big of a difference in networth did reselling make? I wonder if it's possible now to come up with a non resell build that can efficiently clear through waves of creeps.

[Megadramon]

I can't remember exactly, and unfortunately it's impossible for me to find out, but when I played with resell, I got maybe ~370 points. I was able to accumulate like a 223k networth by the end of it. Without reselling I remember I wasn't doing very well, and kind of playing halfheartedly knowing that my networth was in shambles compared to when I had the extra interest.

[Chiquihuite]

If you never did any reselling to begin with, the new changes will force you if you want any hope of getting a good fruit score, otherwise if you don't resell, you'll most definitely get a lower fruit score compared to someone who constantly resells for interest.

This should never be the case for something you get off the element picker. If it becomes mandatory, it restricts choices and removes strategic depth. As I mentioned in the other thread, this might be better suited for one of the available "super weapon" picks as a more passive/economic option.

[Cyranis]

If you never did any reselling to begin with, the new changes will force you if you want any hope of getting a good fruit score, otherwise if you don't resell, you'll most definitely get a lower fruit score compared to someone who constantly resells for interest.

This should never be the case for something you get off the element picker. If it becomes mandatory, it restricts choices and removes strategic depth. As I mentioned in the other thread, this might be better suited for one of the available "super weapon" picks as a more passive/economic option.

Constant reselling seems to me, to be a measure of how much mindless tedium one is willing to put up with. The game has some strategic depth, and I am saddened that the "optimum" method is gaming the system with as many resells as possible. Why even have such a variety of towers and combinations if this was the prime direction of the game? If spam reselling is the prime strategy, one could probably suffice with only the basic ray and grenade towers.

[Megadramon]

Constant reselling is actually more of random gameplay.

I'll admit AP and Random have their different playstyles, and it may not be right to force random gameplay onto ap since the two styles are different (AP being more micro based, while random being more macro based).

Reselling has always been a random thing, and now that we've tried it on AP, the idea doesn't seem to work as well.

[WindStrike]

About the only thing that resell works really well with is a pure tower rush. Otherwise, its uses are for very tedious means that derail the game from a tower defense to... who has the highest APM.

[flyjum]

About the only thing that resell works really well with is a pure tower rush. Otherwise, its uses are for very tedious means that derail the game from a tower defense to... who has the highest APM.

yupe

Also why is interest at less then 2% on lower then very hard?

Those modes should be easier not gimped with less interest

I dont like the current version at all.

Its nearly impossible to beat on very hard and the other modes are really weak with less intrest.

[Vyce663]

You can't really be complaining about a game being hard on its hardest setting can you?

The interest scaling up for VH is the only real reason you can beat it although i don't know honestly why its lower on easier settings.

[flyjum]

You can't really be complaining about a game being hard on its hardest setting can you?

The interest scaling up for VH is the only real reason you can beat it although i don't know honestly why its lower on easier settings.

yea but I have been playing element td since version 2.0 on wc3

I think I should be able to beat it on very hard

I have not gotten past 50 or so

After wave 40 its ramps up really hard in difficultly because how slow towers build and upgrade so selling is very very hard even though this is the most important part of the game in terms of income

from wave 35-55 is the most important part.

[WindStrike]

The reason that lower difficulties have lower interest is because at very easy, you can still camp the front entrance with the strongest towers without having to hoard anything. Heck, it can probably be done with half the money you get. When it was at 2%, it was really easy to eventually spam the entire map with the strongest towers and win the fruit round without a problem, even when getting points at 1/5th the rate of very hard. Besides, enemies are at what, half health and no damage reduction? Shouldn't have any issue even with 1% interest. The same thing kinda applies as you go up the difficulties. Very hard is meant to be very hard, not just something you can interest abuse and win with sheer numbers. Now you need an actual strategy, and if you don't know the best placements for your towers, you won't win. As for resell, I personally just ignore its existence just because I don't like it, unless I'm doing a pure tower rush.

It's still possible to beat very hard without reselling or even 3% interest, you just gotta figure out a build and strategy that'lll work. Though I admit it's considerably difficult to win on Random, especially if you don't have a level 2 triple by round 50.