Arrow/Cannon/Composite Towers. The discussion

[AftermathRV]

This video is kind of important to this discussion, please see it to see where my points are comming from
 

Ait lets start

So here we go. I think Cannon/arrow towers shoudl get a lvl 2 or 3 upgrade, however the level 1 form is really strong - except for cannon towers.

cannon towers in general got the short end of the stick and i think they kinda suck, however the arrow towers are really strong expecially early with pretty amazing DPS. i say its save to say that if we just buff the damage too much you will end up being able to just spam those towers - hell, i ve beaten half the game (and maybe couldve continued a bit more if i wouldnt have tried to force anything) in express mode doing just that

cannon towers just attack way too slow, have no range, and deal way to little AOE or damage in general to make it worth it

I do howveer believe that arrow and cannon towers, and expiecally the 5 element towers are big parts of this game.
or maybe even more : they should be.

What do you guys think of the composite towers? I think there should be 3 more, with some soft mechanics and making them just weak enough to not spam only them however strong enough / giving them update to make them strong enough, to base builds around them. Considering 1/6 of the game/plus icefrogs are composite type, itll be only fair!

[WindStrike]

We've been debating adding the elemental upgrades to the cannon/arrow towers back. I think it might be doable, I just worry that, like in the WC3 and SC2 versions, you'd be able to go through literally half the game without switching off. Granted, w/ 98% sell, that's not nearly as possible, but still rather iffy.

 

I've had people on both ends of the stick tell me cannon is underpowered or overpowered. I'm not entirely sure whether to buff it or not, and if I do buff it, it'd be a very minor amount.

 

As for straight adding more composite towers, we've had someone suggest being able to place mines on the course, which could be cool, I just... don't entirely see their purpose, relative to the other towers. I'm rather reluctant to support more composite towers as it'd shift the game away from the core concept of Elements and more towards these generic towers that are really only supposed to get you through the early game.

 

On the flipside of things, we've still got two empty slots on the Builder, and one of our dev team is saying we should totally fill it with some new options, ie mines. It's a pretty iffy subject.

 

 

At the moment, probably the closest thing we're considering is bringing back the elemental upgrades of Cannon & Arrow Towers, which would give a Tier 2 of what you were suggesting (not quite Composite though), just not a Tier 3. I might suggest bringing them back after Patch 1.5 (which, looking at preliminary estimates, will be completely changing the game). But, we're still welcome to ideas, so keep firin' away!

[Noya]

12 hours ago, WindStrike said:

On the flipside of things, we've still got two empty slots on the Builder, and one of our dev team is saying we should totally fill it with some new options

 

In this special: Crazy developer ideas to fill the builder item slots!

 

Main concept: Path-placed buildings.
This type of buildings aren't placed on the highground, instead, they must be built on the creeps path.
Creeps won't be blocked by them and don't prevent construction either.
Just like towers, they take grid spots and can't be built on top of each other.

 

Various possibilities for this concept:

 

1. Land Mines

- Deals a % of the enemy HP on impact.
- Free of cost, you get some charge(s) every wave(s) but has a max charge count.
- Meant as a safeguard against leaks
Pros:
- Adds some spammable ability to use during downtime
- Chain explosions!
Cons:
- Potentially too strong vs Frogs
- %HP damage has to be handled with care
- The game difficulty must increase to make up for this addition

 

2. Element Enhancer
- Slightly increases damage done to units standing on this path.
- Costs gold and you only get a limited amount of them (either at start or per waves)
- Only upgrades one elemental damage type (default composite)
- Can be upgraded to any unlocked element and can't be reverted

 

3. Wall/Trap
- Initially just a small barricade that slows down the first creep it hits for a short duration.
- The effect is used on the first contact and disabled afterwards.
- It recharges a moderate time after, allowing for the effect to happen again (perhaps once every wave?)
- Same as the others, this would need to be handed in limited amounts.
- Can be upgraded for fancy element effects
    Light: Blinds, runs backwards
    Dark: (Portal) travels back in time
    Water: (Torrent) gets tossed in the air
    Fire: Runs faster but gets increased damage
    Nature: (Thorns) Holds for a larger duration
    Earth: Knockback, cascading the knockback to all those behind in a straight line.
    
These are just concepts and all parts of them can be changed and discussed, the first real question is whether these "path buildings" are worth exploring or not, and if so, what kind of effects could they have?

 

Note that the grid-toggle item can totally be made into an UI button if more interesting concepts come in to fill a 3rd new item slot.

[Karawasa]

Guys I always hesitate at adding more complexity. More content is always good. What does this feature add to the gameplay? What purpose/role does it fill? In other words, why?

[Noya]

You've answered yourself,  more content is always good, as long as its good content.

 

Not only that, but keeping the same content for a prolonged amount of time is not desirable either, game gets stale, loses players, etc. Leaderboard balancing is good but it only appeals to a small portion of the playerbase.

[WindStrike]

I'd personally be up for adding more and new content in the base game itself. Yes, Element TD does have a lot of replayability, but compared to Dota 2, it's a farcry away in "complexity", as the possible combinations and ways to play far outstrip anything Element TD, in its current state, is capable of. However, the base game can only be modded so far, so as long as we got more modes to back it up (and eventually, if we can come up with a good concept, a PvP mode), it should be alright. Still gotta be careful what exactly we add.

 

Of the ideas suggested, I'm partial to the mines, cause nothing else in the game does that. It would have to be balanced carefully for sure to prevent it from being OP (or possibly just straight up underpowered), but it's doable. Anyone got moar thoughts and opinions?

[Noya]

Elemental Arrow & Cannon Towers are back on patch 1.5! Enjoy