gwho
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Posts posted by gwho
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The haste tower will sometimes not attack a unit, even though it is undoubted within range. u just spam click the target, but it doesnt shoot it. it will keep doing what it is doing, whether it be attacking another target, or being idle. i've gotten a ton of leaks due to this.
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so smart!
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Booo! Light 3 >>>> Earth 3 so hard. Pure lights are the best pures in the game IMO and you really really REALLY do not need that artillery upgrade. Just mass a few more mortars because I believe the last light wave is low 50s, after which you can just sell your mortars anyway, buy more annihilations, and get deceits with them.4 annis+1 deceit = 8-9 annis.
This is AWESOME.
Sounds good to me.
for pures, aren't lights good up to level 60 b/c of the range... but once u get to fruit level, there will always be something to attack, so the other towers have better dps than light.
it's like how in melee, a zealot has more dps than a stalker, but the stalker ends up doing more dps b/c the zlot isn't always in contact. if it IS always in contact, the zlot has better dps. zlot = other pures, stalker = light pure.
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for the website, i think the most concise way to write that is
"Attack impact does 40/30/20 damage in 2/4/6 AoE."
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i've definitel ybeen inspired by this build and i've been trying to do it.
i keep messing up on execution so yeah. u really have to watch out for levle 18, 31, and 41 eh?
when i do your orignal build, i go
short mode
interest
interest
nature (nature first b/c of order of waves, plus killing earth more easily)
earth (use mildew tower)
fire
water
fire, earth (for better haste into upgraded quack - haste towers suck against water levels)
water nature
Then light. polar plus some slow is better than a somewhat useless lvl 3 fire.
but i keep messing up so yeah. theoretically u would have enough haste towers to do single target dps, so u wont need ultra pure fire.
as i kept failling, i realized something... and i want to give props to the programmers for making this challenging, enough to be fun. everyone knows how many TD's there are that are just so boring and ez. using interest does away with a lot of that, but the difficulty could still be far easier. i like it this way. nice and challenging.
my main failures are basically remembering that i have to do X for wave number Y. yeah. i would make a horrible watchman or tower guard.
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+1
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I noticed something with Jet Tower that was extremely off. In a nutshell, the AoE was all messed up. It should feel a hell of a lot better next version.oh, was the actual damage value not matching the label?
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This tower sucks anyway. Considering that mildew does 40 (ewwwww) twice as compared to 25 once, it's not even close.mildew 50 jet 40.
jet has more aoe. seems reasonable.
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Helps manage the micro. If the reload time was 17.5 seconds then you'd have to watch them like a hawk 100% of the time. Current stats allows for more flexibility.true, but i dont htink goign from 15 to 14 is doing anything
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Yeah pretty much. I only ever go earth-water using another damage tower so I didn't notice it quite as much as others might, but it basically depends on stacking slows to do anything useful at all. That's a sure sign of a flawed design.all that slow projectil means is it's not good at picking off stray targets. if it targets ground and a train of creeps walk by, it's going to be doing full damage just as if it had a faster projectile.
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But the thing is, F12 text doesnt explain the icons on the score board!
too early to put in obsolete
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interesting...
quake early on and transitoin into hastes.
what is the 3rd fire for? what if that turned into interest right after you get all the level 1 elements?
waht do you think the benefits of going 2 light is, at the end? polar tower with a 30% hp reduction is just crazy. it also allows access to some slow towers.
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-Nerfed Auto Reload (DLN) to 3.5 seconds cast from 3-Buffed Manual Reload (DLN) to 14 second cooldown from 15
going from 15 to 14 is kinda... whats the point?
you wil have to wait through one cycle anyway. (i.e. minimum of 7+3.5 = 10.5)
a nice round number fo 14 doesnt mean u get to reload perfectly.
a perefect reload time would actually be 7 + 3.5 + 7 = 17.5 seconds.
i guess if you could reload right when 14 seconds is up, but you will still have 3 bullets left [14 - (7+3.5) = 3.5]... So why would u want to reload asap at 14 seconds when you have 3 extra bullets ready to shoot right away anyway?
A reload cd of anything between 10.5 and 17.5 is ALL THE SAME. going from something within this range to something else within this range is practically meaningless. (yes you can point out minor situations and benefits, but that is just that - minor).
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net worth is nice, but we don't have enough pieces of info to determine the rest of the picture.
net worth is cash on hand + tower worth (reduced by25% if not playing on random), and it also varies according to whether you killed a creep earlier or later (phase offset)
so if you see net worth of a player, you can't determine the rest of the story.
someone could have the same net worth, but it might be deflated for one player b/c he built elemental towers while not being random. or one player is holding more cash on hand, and using minimal towers, and he later pulls ahead. you wouldn't be able to foresee this using net worth alone, but with cash on hand visible, this would be plain as day, and you would be able to tell "oh he's doing better", even tho the net worth may be the same number as another player.
If we had one more piece of info, it would be enough.
The best piece of info would be "cash on hand".
if this info was also visible, we would know how strong your economy, as well as other players economy are. If you know cash on hand, you know that the rest of it is is invested into towers. If you know cash on hand, you know how much a player will get at the next interest cycle (if you know their interest rate also).
i know it's hard to fit more info on that chart without making it bigger, but this info would be really nice.
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Hello!
I really enjoy playing this map. Awesome.I have been playing with haste towers with forge build and managed to get some descent fruit kills.
I would like to hear your thoughts
Description:
Difficulty: Normal
Towers used: Haste(EFW), Forge(FE) and Earth(E)
Build: $$ EFW EFW EF P
which is,
Interest, Interest, Earth, Fire, Water, Earth, Fire, Water, Earth, Fire and Pure Essense.
Strategy:
- Place towers spread out across the map. Waves killed late means more interest. This also gives more time to react to leaks.
- Use Earth Towers to complement DPS on Water creeps where Haste tower is weak against.
- Spend as little as possible to hold off each wave to accumulate minerals using interest.
- Build 3 Pure Earth towers. With 4-6 fully upgraded haste towers and 3-4 forges, it should hold up to level 60.
- Upgrading takes time and must be planned ahead. Between level 50-59, fill the map with 1st tier towers to be upgraded later.
- When mineral reserve reach 500k to 600k or the wave hit level 60, upgrade all towers to the max level.
- Build 1 forge tower for every 3 to 4 haste towers.
- On fruit round, click on fruits about to get away, if the lag isn't killing the frame rate. lol
Results:
- 356kills - Public game, Pre v1.74(before haste tower buff)
- 384kills - Solo, Pre v1.74
- 389kills - Solo, Post v1.74
I will try this on hard and very hard difficulties to see how I fare. As far as fruit kills go, the tweaks on haste tower did not seem to affect haste tower much.
so u weren't even playing on VH?
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Compare this to other damage towers.Celerity (FNW): 1/5. Range, but not good damage or aoe, though it has good secondary damage (FW), but can't quad element to get both an amp and slow support. Micro intensive.
Torrent (LNW): 1/5. Gets counter damage with LW and has aoe, but no 4th element will give it both level 3 supports. (Earth gives amp, darkness gives nothing, fire gives slow) Micro intensive.
Flooding (DNW): 2/5 because it gets counter damage by 4th elementing into light, but no level 3 supports. It has good single target damage, but no AoE and very mediocre range.
Laser (DEL): 3/5 because it gets access to both support towers and counter damage via nature. It has good single target damage, but mediocre range and poor aoe (I count it as focusing all the fighters at once--either way, it either has good aoe or good single target, but not both at once). Of course, if you go nature for the counter towers, this just becomes a bonus to the obliteration tower and should more or less not be built at all anyway.
How do you feel about these towers now?
celerity
oo it's been upped to 500 is getting there, but still might need more.
For simpicity of calculation, why dont we make it range / 11 * 500? max range is 22, so we will know the average damage is 500, and the max damage is double that value.
still comparing it to obliteration tower, obliteration does 400 x3 + 200*2 = 1600 damage.
just a typical value, assuming 2 creeps get hit by full AOE, and 2 creeps get hit by half AOE.
The obliteration tower CAN do more damage with appropriate slows, but the celerity will do at most, 22/14*500 damage, which is not even 1000 damage.
to further demonstrate how !#%&!#%!#% ING crappy the celerity tower is.
I will also go with pure light tower over celerity tower. You're really being shy with buffing celerity.
compare it to level 2 pure light tower: (when you have 2 light elements)
cost is half of celerity tower
requires 2 elements, but celerity requires 3.
range is same
dps is 760.
AM I SERIOSULY GOING TO DO ALL THAT MICRO (which i will not do perfectly) for 20 extra damage??????
seriously, celerity is a nice concept, but in order to have any niche, it's going to need a TON of damage. making the formula range/11*1000 is more like it. dead serious.
but if we do that it will be too OP. the solution is to give it really slow attack speed! that way, even if you 1 shot consistently, even up to high levels, the # of creeps you can kill will be limited. So even if it has OP damage, you will still leak. That is the concept of celerity tower that will actually have a niche.
that niche is:
the tower that can one shot creeps up to around level 30, is micro-intensive tower that you have to baby sit constantly, but can't kill that many units due to its slow attack speed. I think it's the only way to save this tower. if it simply does damage, it's just too hard to make it worthwhile - ther are other towers that have all the good aspects of celerity tower without the drawback.
proposed celerity tower:
attack speed: 4
damage: range/11*1000.
so max damage is 2000. that may seem like a lot, but it's not. wave 37 and wave 39 have HP's 1800 and 2100 respectively. within 2 levels the critical hp has been surpassed. so my point is, it's not going to have a super big effect on the range of levels it will one shot.
Next, damage reduction means it can 1 shot until level 37ish for very easy, and level 34 for very hard. See how everything is confined within wave 34 to wave 37?
Finally, 1 shot tower is 1 shot tower. very micro intensive. it will one shot until the above mentioned levels. The earliest you can get a triple tower is around level 22 if u start on short, or around level 16 if u abuse interset from the very beginning. But you wont want to get it that early either way: The celerity tower will be designed so that it can't kill most of the wave by itself. you'll be leaking if you rush for it. Secondly, if you are interest abusing , you wont want to sink all that money into a tower that can't even handle the entire wave. The bottom line is, the window of the celerity tower's one-shotting is about 10 levels. after that, it will be more than that. useless? a hell of a lot more useful than it is now!
Torrent:
u know, this tower, unlike a lot of other towers is not redundant. its mechanics is unique and makes for good micro with the an appropriate frequency requirement (not 24/7).
I never really used it much b/c it seemed weaker, but with buffs, this tower really does have a place, and is quite unique.
Flooding:
NICE! seems like it will be worth it.
is "damage dealt" only the damage dealt by this tower?
Writing "HP lost" and "HP remaining" would be much more clearer.
what you wrote is kind of confusing b/c typically, with chance to kill, you're used to percentages. ur using fractions, right? so half hp means guaranteed kill?
talk about crazy mega ultra major buff. It's nice that it's very high attack rate. Keep that. but if i understood it correctly, this chance formula is way freaken high. why not only damage creeps to half health, and then have a flooding tower or two at the end? we've essentially reduced the difficulty of all level 30 and higher by half. can you imagine fruit level with this? reduced the chance reduce it by a frICK TON. of course, i may have misunderstood the way it works. If so, then the description still needs to be made more clear.
If damage dealt means damage dealt by this tower, then that means this tower gets more and more useless the longer the game goes. damage dealt / current HP will be less and less b/c the current HP increases to achieve the same chance. this is because the max HP increases for later waves. if you've lowered the later waves by that much, you will have strong towers to finish them off anyway. There is a really big systematic problem with the formula, whichever way it is that it is intended to work.
Laser:
did it get nerfed?
5 attacks at 120 damage each. 560 damage. pass. the 5 fighters simply mean that there will be less overshooting. but the damage cap is kinda low. if i want a "clean up crew" i'll invest in a specialized single target tower, since i'll need one anyway.
comparing to celerity: about 560 guarnateed damage, compared to 785 max, 350 average, and 80 min. 200 or so damage difference, is not worth all that apm. i will definitely go with laser tower over celerity tower.
idk about how the laser tower works now, but between toggling single target and multi target, one mode should have greater overall dps than the other mode. if it's exactly the smae, it's kind of pointless to have those two modes.
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in the info box, we have an icon for the ability of creep waves.
but u dont know waht they mean
if you click the creep itself, it still doesnt show what ability they have. it seems the only place you can know is thru the website.
this shoudl not be. it should be intuitive and directly read from the game.
Put that same icon on the creep as a buff icon, that you can mouseover and see what it does.
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Heh, I was about to suggest this very thing. I still don't have the icons memorized, and the mouse-over would help very much. Ifeelam at a big disadvantage not knowing what type of wave is coming since I don't know what the icons mean
we think alike eh =]
i really dont htink it would be that hard to recognize icons if they were used more consistently. all the upgrades on the elemental tower keep changing. if the light icon stayed as the same light icon earth, fire, etc, and simply distinguish with numbers, then it would be very quick to catch on to.
they didn't like that suggestion tho. i still think there's too many icons.
Another problem is that the icons for the creep abilities aren't stated either. Even if you click the creep itself. we should have this.
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edited OP.
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And chiquihuite, the deceit towers are definitely the weakest. I believe they create up to 4 clones, and each tower can only be cloned once (EG you can't get a single pure light, mass deceits, and get a zillion pure light clones, though that'd be nice). So you get 4*100% from deceit, but from factory/fountain, you get 4*120%.Length of clone is 80 seconds at level 3. This means you can get 5 clones rolling at a time per deceit tower, plus a 6th for a few seconds. For 20 seconds out of 80 you can have two clones of the *same* tower (lol3pures). It's noticeably stronger than Well/Forge before positioning is considered.
once 60 seconds is over a tower can be cloned again tho, right?
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watashi shi comprende...
what's the point of weighting by difficulty?
we could do it by time, or any other variable.
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If it's competitive mode, it has to be one difficulty for everyone. Also, my opinion of highest difficulty has changed. See the thread in GD for my more rigorous algorithm.same difficulty agreed. competing when one person is not the same? ridiculous.
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competetive mode: first guy to finish triggers next wave
regular mode: "average-th" player triggers the next wave
Well and Forge Towers
in StarCraft 2
Posted
sometimes these towers just dont work.
you have them on autocast, their cd is compelted and ready to cast, there is a tower within its range that does not have the buff, but it wont go.
Sometimes it wont go for a really long time. but you can manually cast it at any point the cd is up.
the cd should really be written on the webpage.
the cd says 12 seconds and the buff lasts 60 seconds so a support tower can support up to 5 towers right?
i think i remember reading the cd was 15 seconds somewhere.