Suggestion: Change the Wars mode in StarCraft 2 Posted September 7, 2012 Hi there, WindStrike. Thank you very much for replying (and reading) my entire post. I appreciate it. In most points with you, I can't but agree. The intelligence factor really is rather quite low. What I usually see is this: Play normal mode (90% of games), and 1-3 will reach fruit wave (from 8 starting). Start with hard, and only one will reach fruit wave, that being me, since the chances of meeting someone who can play well is pretty minimal. And we don't even need to discuss very hard here... That said I also have to completely agree with what you said about income. This is a tricky problem, where the player who amasses most income will instantly win. This is one point I haven't gotten into, but which I should have looked at, so thank you for drawing my attention to it. I will take some time to discuss the options I see to resolve this: My own personal suggestion would be to devise a system which is similar to the one already in place: Right now you can save up lots of cash to get more interest income, but do this too much and creeps will start to leak. Thus, the problem of "I have 100k, and I keep getting richer very quick), is avoided. In the new wars mode, this would have to be something similar. Perhaps the easiest way to solve this would be to make a crossover system. Such as this: Creeps cost two sorts of resources, namely sand AND minerals. The creeps give SAND income, which is used to send higher level creeps, so you can raise that as you please. However, if you raise it too much, you will not have enough minerals to build towers anymore. When using this, you need an incentive for players to send creeps, as I already mentioned, to avoid them sending no creeps at all. If cleverly implemented, this would completely eliminate the need for a unit cap (except in extreme cases, where all players unite to send the cheapest units en masse), because players will not be able to send too much, since it will drain their minerals. One way to provide an incentive would be, for instance, that the players HAVE to send a certain number of creeps, or, even better: A specific VALUE of creeps (it could be made so that every creep has a value, and a system keeps watch over how much "value" the players have sent) in order for them to get something they need. The easiest way I can think of is that they get a tower value cap, depending on how much creep value they have spent. Let's assume my total tower worth is 35, so 5 canon towers. In order to build more, I need to send a certain creep value. This would be very easy to implement, since all that needs to be done is to scale this linearly. So, let's say I send 50 creep value, then I might build 200 tower value. I send 100 creep value, I can build 400 tower value, and so on. (Adjusting this would take a bit of balancing work, but it is far easier than all the other ideas I have down below). Now, thank you for reading this far, I can finally get to your questions xD 1) Yes, I absolutely recommend that creeps still give you minerals. This will move the whole game at a steady pace (determined by the parameters and variables which are set) since the more you send, the more powerful your opponents become, but the less you send, the weaker you get (see above). This should provide steady upwards pressure to send stuff, but not to send too much. 2) This idea you put forth is very interesting. It could be incredibly hard to balance, and it would add a layer of complexity which most players probably couldn't cope with anyway. However, If correctly implemented, I think it would be fantastic. This would allow you to try and specialize on towers (if I have understood your idea correctly), or rather, on elements. This would lead to your opponents having incentive to outsmart you by building counters to you and so on. I can't think of any way to explain this to some of the zombie-players out there, but then again, let's face it: Most players won't play "wars" anyway, and the ones that do probably know what they want. Besides, plenty of games which are highly complex have absolutely NO information to help you, and are still played by hundreds of thousands of people. 3) Again, a very tricky question. I'd say this depends on your taste. Scaling creeps as the game progresses makes it much simpler to implement and balance, as you don't have to worry too much. It would also eliminate the need to think up too many creeps, since you just, at the basis, need 8 of them: 1 composite, one for every element, and one fruit. And, except for the fruit which is only available late game, you can just scale up the elements. I think scaling them in the summoning center would, however, be more entertaining. In order to avoid overflowing, the summoning center could only allow sending of say, 28 different varieties of creeps. This would allow 7 different elements and composite (4 each) at any given moment. Then, the game could steadily replace the weakest of these with stronger ones. So, let's say composite: In the first few levels, the game might only allow you to summon 5 different creeps. Then, at level 4, for example, it adds a 6th. At level 5 it might add 6 new ones (one for each element). Moving upwards, after a while, the weakest (like cows) get discarded, while new strong ones are moved in. Then, the second weakest until then becomes the new weakest. This would be like a conveyor belt, so to speak, where stronger creeps keep getting put onto the belt, and moves to the trash disposal bin. Cows then might get replaced by those strange red birds (don't know their name, wave 3), which then would get replaced by those urdasomethings (wave 5), and so on. This is not too difficult to implement (it just needs lots of different creeps), and provides a nifty illusion of variety. How many different creeps the game would need then depends on how many different ones you want to be capable of sending. This could then culminate in sending fruits, which then start, wave by wave (or ending at wave 61, depending on your taste), to become stronger and stronger. This then reunites the two systems (wars and normal mode) At this stage, the players will have huge pressure on them: On the one hand, they need to send as much as they can to blast their enemies, on the other they need to build more towers to avoid getting squished themselves. All of this in view of the fact that they aren't getting money any more. Again, this would eliminate the need for any sort of limiting system, since players will, after a while, simply not be capable of sending zillions of weak units, since they just disappear. Edit: Perhaps one would need to scale this also with the player's sand income, since I can foresee a point of no return here: Imagine a player doesn't send anything, then after a while the creeps get too expensive for him to send ANYTHING, and he would be out of the game soon thereafter, since while he gets lots of pressure, he can exert none. Thanks for reading. I added here some nifty stuff, just for the gist of it, but which I don't consider intelligent. Just interesting. -----------This stuff I only added for the fun of it-------------- Another way to provide incentives would be, for instance, the elements. Let's say that we still get an element every 5 waves. Alright then, but the element is only obtained when we have sent, say, 30 creep value at wave 5, 100 creep value at wave 10, 500 creep value at wave 15, and so on. Again, mathematics could save the day here, by providing a function which scales the value of the creeps with the approximate wave level, and then produces the optimal amount of creep value needed for each element. Another crazy idea to prevent players with the highest income to rush to the top too fast: One possibility which I can see, but which would, admittedly, be incredibly hard to balance, is that building towers (or maybe rather owning towers) will lower your sand interest. This could be done by percentage points. So, for instance, own 5 canon towers, and your sand interest rate is reduced by 1% or something like that. One could implement an interesting mathematical function here, which will reduce your sand income up to a certain maximum (say 80%). This would result in a system where a player who has the most income has, by default, fewer towers, which will again lead him into trouble. Thus, the player would need to balance his building towers. As you said, the problem of missing intelligence in the servers (and let me assure you, it's no better in EU than it is in NA), would make this level of complexity near impossible for most players. -------------End Crazy stuff------------------- Cheers!